Official Training Q&A Thread

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Comments

  • badass_vinchbadass_vinch Posts: 4,471
    bigboygori wrote:
    kuya vinch yung left wrist ko nga fucked up na, tapos yung right forearm ko parang may sumasakit sa buto everytime na pipiga ako ng barbell. Errr, parang nakaka guilty kung dadalian ko yung workout, ano ma susuggest mo na alisin ko jan kuya? haha sorry super haba, pinost ko para makita at maintindihan maigi :p


    bigboygori... alam mo bro, medyo complicated yung concern mo to be honest. Yes, you may be doing too much and not having enough recovery which is not good. but the question here is about your routine, is it optimal or not? and that's an individual thing. i'm a little hesitant on giving advices especially about training and nutrition kasi most members here are newbies at iwas ako magbigay ng info na hindi applicable sa nakararami. Internet na bahala kung gusto nila ng sakit sa ulo hehe.

    obviously, you did get results from your routine, some people may get hospitalized doing it, some may get bored etc but depende nga sa individual. Sa totoo lang, your routine is exactly what i did for my first 3yrs, back then i dont know shit and the only way i know how to get to my goal is thru hardwork and pain. did i get results? yes! but if i was educated i would probably rethink my training style. looking back at those years, thankful ako that i was that ignorant kasi it taught me more than what i can google which is HARDWORK and the "NO PAIN NO GAIN MENTALITY".

    Now, why am i telling you to cut the volume down? simple man, your starting to feel joint problems! if you feel guilty cutting down on training then do some adjustments on your rest days and diet (rest and eat more). for now, bawasan mo muna yung volume mo then when your body is craving for more tsaka mo bugbugin ulit yung sarili mo hangang matuto ka sa mga mali mo. hehehe yun yon bro! trial and error....

    check out japolifts journal, big dawg posted a routine their and i think you'll be guided by that.
  • Big DawgBig Dawg Posts: 645
    You take a beginner and they will damn near grow on ANY routine even if it is overtraining. However, one will grow MORE training smartly. Indeed we are all different, but that routine is wayyy too many exercises. I mean doing incline, decline and flats on bb bench AND db bench AND flyes? Thats 27 sets for chest. Same for back - you're doing so many types of lat pulldowns. Redundancy my friend - no need to do flat bb AND flat db in same workout. No need to do incline bb AND incline db in same workout. You will grow more muscle by upping your intensity and doing MUCH less. If you are busting ass on every workset, there is no way you can do all that period. A quick revision might look like this:

    DAY 1 - CHEST/TRICEPS

    CHEST-

    Barbell Bench Press (10,8,6)
    Incline Dumbell Press (10,8,6)
    Dips (12,10,8)
    Dumbbell Flyes (12,10,8)

    TRICEPS-

    Close Grip Bench Press (10,8,6)
    Skullcrushers - (10,8,8)

    You may look at the above routine and think "damn that ain't shit how can I grow doing so much less than before".The answer is INTENSITY. Those are worksets - that means busting ass to failure or at least within 1 rep of failure. There's no pacing your sets. I've seen many guys at the gym in my 2 years her ein Philippines doing all that volume work and every exercise in the book - they aren't big. They look the same as last year. It's bcoz they aren't pushing themselves hard enuff. Put your cellphone away, focus in your mind every set before you even lift the bar that you WILL get the reps. Always try to increase the weight every workout or get 1 more rep. This game really isn't rocket science - it's about busting balls on the basic, compound movements. Do that, eat right, and rest enuff and you will grow dude. :)
  • allen101allen101 Posts: 5,102
    Big Dawg wrote:
    You take a beginner and they will damn near grow on ANY routine even if it is overtraining. However, one will grow MORE training smartly. Indeed we are all different, but that routine is wayyy too many exercises. I mean doing incline, decline and flats on bb bench AND db bench AND flyes? Thats 27 sets for chest. Same for back - you're doing so many types of lat pulldowns. Redundancy my friend - no need to do flat bb AND flat db in same workout. No need to do incline bb AND incline db in same workout. You will grow more muscle by upping your intensity and doing MUCH less. If you are busting ass on every workset, there is no way you can do all that period. A quick revision might look like this:

    DAY 1 - CHEST/TRICEPS

    CHEST-

    Barbell Bench Press (10,8,6)
    Incline Dumbell Press (10,8,6)
    Dips (12,10,8)
    Dumbbell Flyes (12,10,8)

    TRICEPS-

    Close Grip Bench Press (10,8,6)
    Skullcrushers - (10,8,8)

    You may look at the above routine and think "damn that ain't shit how can I grow doing so much less than before".The answer is INTENSITY. Those are worksets - that means busting ass to failure or at least within 1 rep of failure. There's no pacing your sets. I've seen many guys at the gym in my 2 years her ein Philippines doing all that volume work and every exercise in the book - they aren't big. They look the same as last year. It's bcoz they aren't pushing themselves hard enuff. Put your cellphone away, focus in your mind every set before you even lift the bar that you WILL get the reps. Always try to increase the weight every workout or get 1 more rep. This game really isn't rocket science - it's about busting balls on the basic, compound movements. Do that, eat right, and rest enuff and you will grow dude. :)

    This.
  • bigboygoribigboygori Posts: 34
    Quality over quantity. Make sure na may stimulation ang muscles then that's it. You don't need to annihilate every muscle fiber in your body. IMO if you're not used to making programs, try searching for one muna. We have lots of choices in the vault. Once you've got the hang of your body's response to training, that's when you tweak your program or make one.

    Sige kuya, I'll do that. Salamat po sa reply! :)
    bigboygori wrote:
    kuya vinch yung left wrist ko nga fucked up na, tapos yung right forearm ko parang may sumasakit sa buto everytime na pipiga ako ng barbell. Errr, parang nakaka guilty kung dadalian ko yung workout, ano ma susuggest mo na alisin ko jan kuya? haha sorry super haba, pinost ko para makita at maintindihan maigi :p


    bigboygori... alam mo bro, medyo complicated yung concern mo to be honest. Yes, you may be doing too much and not having enough recovery which is not good. but the question here is about your routine, is it optimal or not? and that's an individual thing. i'm a little hesitant on giving advices especially about training and nutrition kasi most members here are newbies at iwas ako magbigay ng info na hindi applicable sa nakararami. Internet na bahala kung gusto nila ng sakit sa ulo hehe.

    obviously, you did get results from your routine, some people may get hospitalized doing it, some may get bored etc but depende nga sa individual. Sa totoo lang, your routine is exactly what i did for my first 3yrs, back then i dont know shit and the only way i know how to get to my goal is thru hardwork and pain. did i get results? yes! but if i was educated i would probably rethink my training style. looking back at those years, thankful ako that i was that ignorant kasi it taught me more than what i can google which is HARDWORK and the "NO PAIN NO GAIN MENTALITY".

    Now, why am i telling you to cut the volume down? simple man, your starting to feel joint problems! if you feel guilty cutting down on training then do some adjustments on your rest days and diet (rest and eat more). for now, bawasan mo muna yung volume mo then when your body is craving for more tsaka mo bugbugin ulit yung sarili mo hangang matuto ka sa mga mali mo. hehehe yun yon bro! trial and error....

    check out japolifts journal, big dawg posted a routine their and i think you'll be guided by that.

    Ahhhhhh. Minsan kasi nakaka guilty pag konti lang yung ginagawa ko, pakiramdam ko di ko na pupush yung sarili ko haha! Pero mali nga, imbis na paabante, paatras ang nagiging resulta. Sige sige kuya, I'll keep that in mind. Dami ko natututunan dito sa forum haha! Salamat po! :)
  • allen101allen101 Posts: 5,102
    Kulang nga lang sa intensity siguro bro as they say above.
  • bigboygoribigboygori Posts: 34
    Big Dawg wrote:
    You take a beginner and they will damn near grow on ANY routine even if it is overtraining. However, one will grow MORE training smartly. Indeed we are all different, but that routine is wayyy too many exercises. I mean doing incline, decline and flats on bb bench AND db bench AND flyes? Thats 27 sets for chest. Same for back - you're doing so many types of lat pulldowns. Redundancy my friend - no need to do flat bb AND flat db in same workout. No need to do incline bb AND incline db in same workout. You will grow more muscle by upping your intensity and doing MUCH less. If you are busting ass on every workset, there is no way you can do all that period. A quick revision might look like this:

    DAY 1 - CHEST/TRICEPS

    CHEST-

    Barbell Bench Press (10,8,6)
    Incline Dumbell Press (10,8,6)
    Dips (12,10,8)
    Dumbbell Flyes (12,10,8)

    TRICEPS-

    Close Grip Bench Press (10,8,6)
    Skullcrushers - (10,8,8)

    You may look at the above routine and think "damn that ain't shit how can I grow doing so much less than before".The answer is INTENSITY. Those are worksets - that means busting ass to failure or at least within 1 rep of failure. There's no pacing your sets. I've seen many guys at the gym in my 2 years her ein Philippines doing all that volume work and every exercise in the book - they aren't big. They look the same as last year. It's bcoz they aren't pushing themselves hard enuff. Put your cellphone away, focus in your mind every set before you even lift the bar that you WILL get the reps. Always try to increase the weight every workout or get 1 more rep. This game really isn't rocket science - it's about busting balls on the basic, compound movements. Do that, eat right, and rest enuff and you will grow dude. :)

    Oo nga kuya, napansin ko nga din parang hindi ako masyado nag iimprove. Lampas 1 month ko na ginagawa to pero yung progress ko hindi okay, tapos hirap pa din ako mag dagdag ng weight, lalo na sa bench. Sige kuya, try ko tweak ulit yung program ko, then pakita ko sa inyo ulit. Maraming salamat po sa reply at sa tips! :sport:
    allen101 wrote:
    Kulang nga lang sa intensity siguro bro as they say above.

    Ganun na nga kuya, napapansin ko din kasi minsan, lalo na pag last set na yung mga heavy, mas matagal ang pinapahinga ko, napapatagal pa lalo pag bandang dulo na ng workout dahil sa sobrang daming sets haha! Pero namulat na ata ako ngayon, mukang mali ang pagkaka intindi ko sa NO PAIN, NO GAIN :p Salamat sa reply kuya.:sport:
  • zehelzehel Posts: 43
    hmm..

    nabasa ko kay sir vinch "You dont grow while training, you grow while resting." madami nag sabi sakin totoo naman to eh. ang di ko lang alam kung tama yung ginagawa kong resting.

    eh ok lang ba yung ganito?

    1 month on / 2 to 3 weeks off

    sa 1 month on

    mon - ches bb
    tue - legs
    wed - shoulder
    thur - back
    fri - ches db
    sat - arms
    sun - rest
    (4 to 5 exercises kada bodypart, 50 mins to 1 hour)

    sa 2 to 3 weeks off

    1x a week every monday nag bbuhat ng bench, squats, row, or bench , dead lift , pull ups

    ok lang ba yung pahinga ko? o bawasan ko pa yung mga araw na nag bubuhat ako.
  • Big DawgBig Dawg Posts: 645
    zehel wrote:
    hmm..

    nabasa ko kay sir vinch "You dont grow while training, you grow while resting." madami nag sabi sakin totoo naman to eh. ang di ko lang alam kung tama yung ginagawa kong resting.

    eh ok lang ba yung ganito?

    1 month on / 2 to 3 weeks off

    sa 1 month on

    mon - ches bb
    tue - legs
    wed - shoulder
    thur - back
    fri - ches db
    sat - arms
    sun - rest
    (4 to 5 exercises kada bodypart, 50 mins to 1 hour)

    sa 2 to 3 weeks off

    1x a week every monday nag bbuhat ng bench, squats, row, or bench , dead lift , pull ups

    ok lang ba yung pahinga ko? o bawasan ko pa yung mga araw na nag bubuhat ako.

    Bro it don't work like that. The body needs to recover from workout to workout, not only the muscles but the cns. You can't just punish it for a month, then expect to grow by taking off 2 or 3 weeks.lol Working out 6 days straight will lead to overtraining fast. Perhaps if you were on AAS you could get away with it, but even then I wouldn't advise hitting the iron for more than 3 days straight before taking a rest day.

    p.s - Sorry I don't know much tagalog, so if my response was off base, then my bad. :)
  • zehelzehel Posts: 43
    @sir Big Dawg- di ko alam yung AAS pero nag google ako, tama ba to? anabolic-androgenic steroids?

    mali nga yata ginagawa ko? yun siguro reason kung bakit sa 4th week di ko na mabuhat ng maayos yung mga binubuhat ko.

    eh kung gagawin kong 3 days straight tapos 1 day off, 3 days straight, hanggang maka 1 month ok po ba yun? o maiksi parin pahinga ? o gawin kong 3 days on 2 days off hanggang maka 1 month, or maiksi parin?
  • badass_vinchbadass_vinch Posts: 4,471
    @bigboygori: i would also like to stress out the importance of proper form and execution of the exercises. Make sure you target the muscle when you lift. Very common for pressing moves to recruit more front delts rather than chest. Master your form first coz going heavy with shitty form is useless.
  • DSmallDivideDSmallDivide Posts: 4,565
    zehel wrote:
    hmm..

    nabasa ko kay sir vinch "You dont grow while training, you grow while resting." madami nag sabi sakin totoo naman to eh. ang di ko lang alam kung tama yung ginagawa kong resting.

    eh ok lang ba yung ganito?

    1 month on / 2 to 3 weeks off

    sa 1 month on

    mon - ches bb
    tue - legs
    wed - shoulder
    thur - back
    fri - ches db
    sat - arms
    sun - rest
    (4 to 5 exercises kada bodypart, 50 mins to 1 hour)

    sa 2 to 3 weeks off

    1x a week every monday nag bbuhat ng bench, squats, row, or bench , dead lift , pull ups

    ok lang ba yung pahinga ko? o bawasan ko pa yung mga araw na nag bubuhat ako.

    Hmmmm... what is the purpose of having 3 weeks off? after a month of lifting?

    also what is also the purpose of hitting the gym 6 days a week? (don't get me wrong i've done a 5 day split before so i'm just asking the reasonwhy would you want to do that) :)
  • zehelzehel Posts: 43
    @sir dsmalldivide - *3 weeks off* wala po naisip ko lang, *hitting the gym 6 days a week* wala din po, naisip ko lang din. kaya po ko nag tatanong kung ano mas effective, kesa sa ginagawa ko, kasi di ko talaga alam kung tama ba tong mga rest/buhat na to, ayon nga bali ang sabi nga dito ay hindi maganda yung ginagawa ko. kaya po ano kaya mas epektibong paraan, ilan beses lang sa isang linggo dapat ang buhat ko?
  • DSmallDivideDSmallDivide Posts: 4,565
    Ok. so it was something out of whim then. I would agree to the suggestions given to you by big dawg, give your body enough time to recover like ng nabasa mo sa posts ni vinch (and what we always tell to everyone here) "you don't grow inside the gym", you grow outside of it while your eating, watching TV, sleeping or simply sitting on your couch and what not. Like i've said earlier i've done a 5-day split before after doing 3 day splits for a while, and there were pros and cons to it at the very least for my current "work capacity"

    Pro's
    *it allows me to focus more on certain "lagging" body parts that i need to work on it allowed mo to focus on my arms (take note "arms" not just biceps) and delts
    *it also allowed me shorter training sessions (prolly around 45 mins max)
    *it gave me "considerable" gains take note not considerable not impressive

    Con's
    *It consumes too much time from me every week in the sense of days i spent "going" to the gym when i can compress my workouts into 3-4 visits instead of 5 so i could use the extra day recovering or doing something else
    *i'm having a hard time when it comes to the recovery of my CNS w/c is very important at the very least to me since i'm mainly into strength training secondary physique. and the poundage of my 2 lifts (squat and DL) are already no joke to me so i need to have my CNS fully recovered in order to lift my poundages and avoid risking injury.

    So my take is, it would be ideal for now to space your workout 3-4 days max so you'll have more recovery time. If you really want to venture on doing a 5-6 day split, work on your "work capacity" first and "recovery speed" (w/c will take a lot time btw) once you get the knack on how to recover faster between workouts then you can decide on adding more split days to your workouts.

    About your planned "3 week" vacation after lifitng 4 weeks , i think 3 weeks is way too long to rest for a 4 week lifting cycle. unless you are injured or you just finished a full 10-12 weeks of training cycle yes i believe longer deload periods are fine. you might end up procrastinating or worst never go back to lifting if you rest way too much. 1 week deload is ok for the time being.

    The key here is "too much of anything ain't good".
  • badass_vinchbadass_vinch Posts: 4,471
    zehel wrote:
    hmm..

    nabasa ko kay sir vinch "You dont grow while training, you grow while resting." madami nag sabi sakin totoo naman to eh. ang di ko lang alam kung tama yung ginagawa kong resting.

    eh ok lang ba yung ganito?

    1 month on / 2 to 3 weeks off

    sa 1 month on

    mon - ches bb
    tue - legs
    wed - shoulder
    thur - back
    fri - ches db
    sat - arms
    sun - rest
    (4 to 5 exercises kada bodypart, 50 mins to 1 hour)

    sa 2 to 3 weeks off

    1x a week every monday nag bbuhat ng bench, squats, row, or bench , dead lift , pull ups

    ok lang ba yung pahinga ko? o bawasan ko pa yung mga araw na nag bubuhat ako.


    try this man, inadjust ko lang yung split mo but its still the same.
    mon - chest
    tue - legs
    wed - REST
    thur - back
    fri - shoulder
    sat - arms and abs
    sun - REST
    REPEAT

    kung confused ka what to do, wag ka na muna magisip. sit back, relax and focus on what you want to achieve for today. if training day mo today FOCUS ON BRINGING YOUR A-GAME! that's it! if rest day mo today, EAT AND SLEEP! that's it!. Do your thing day in and day out with no excuses, it's that simple.
  • JettieJettie Posts: 3,763
    kung confused ka what to do, wag ka na muna magisip. sit back, relax and focus on what you want to achieve for today

    Hehe applicable sa lahat regarding nutrition and workout!
  • nrg500nrg500 Posts: 1,233
    Lilipat na ako ng gym dahil yung pinagbubuhatan ko ngayon ay lumiit ang space at masyado ng crowded ang equipment at tao

    May nakita na ako na pwedeng lipatan. ok ang space, ang equipment, large diameter plates at olympic bars pa ang gamit. Ang problema ko lang ay 5 lbs ang smallest plate nila. so kung mag-increase ako ng load sa next session, 10 lbs ang minimum

    ano ba pwede kong gawin ?

    wala naman akong makitang tindahan na may small plates na pwede for olympic bar


    meron bang "sub-standard" na olympic bar ? pakiramdam ko kasi ay parang walang 45 lbs yung olympic bar nila nung binuhat ko. parang nasa ~30 lbs lang yata
  • JettieJettie Posts: 3,763
    naka try na ko ng ganyan 30lbs lang hehe.. saka yung sa mascu parang ganun din.. pero meron sila yung standard.. ( tinuro ni sir milks yun ).

    About sa plates, try mo sa Ensayo hehe
  • milksworthmilksworth Posts: 3,130
    kung yung oly bar na malaki ang diameter sa dulo and its from ensayo, im sure 45lbs yun. pero kung oly bar na standard size lang i think its about 20-25lbs only. sadya ka sa ensayo meron silang 2.5lbs plate na malaki ang butas pang oly bar.
  • nrg500nrg500 Posts: 1,233
    @ milksworth

    makakatulong po ba ang pagsagad sa negative phase ng exercise ?

    halimbawa

    Bench Press

    Week 1: 140 lbs @ 6 reps

    Week 2: 140 lbs @ 6 reps + 2 negatives

    Week 3: 140 lbs @ 6 reps + 4 negatives

    Week 4: 140 lbs @ 6 reps + 6 negatives

    Week 5: 150 lbs @ 6 reps ????

    ^ pwede po ang ganyan load progression scheme kung 10 lbs talaga ang minimum na increase ?

    napanood ko kasi Blood and Guts ni Dorian Yates, pag nag-train to failure ka, positive phase strength ang unang nade-deplete. Sa case ng bench press, kung 6 reps ang max at di na maiangat para sa next rep, spotter ang mag-aangat ng bar tapos ikaw lang mag-isa sa negative phase hanggang sa di mo na rin kaya ang negative phase

    sana po malinaw ang explanation ko

    thanks :)
  • milksworthmilksworth Posts: 3,130
    im not sure kung tulong para saan ang hinahanap mo at need mo mag add ng negative reps lang sa exercise.

    as for me i really dont count how many failure reps im making in a set if ever na mag train ako to failure on a particular exercise. as much as possible im still giving my best to push for the positive part kahit na fatigued na ako. for me it doesnt make sense kung puro negative na lang in the end ang pakikiramdaman mo. i think its better this way. just aim for a number of set that you think you can still lift kahit na may spot na at hanggang doon na lang, like 15 to 25 reps but i doubt you can do this with a heavy load.
  • cocoycocoy Posts: 7
    newbie lang po ako sa forum 6 moths na ako nagwowork out ano dapat gawin kc sa db press dati 40lbs ginagamit ko parang magaan na sakin nun nag dagdag ako ng 10lbs parang may sumakit sa shoulder ko 3 weeks na hanngang ngayon po may sakit parin at nag iba yng lakas nya dna gaya ng dati pero nailalaro ko parin pero d gaya ng dati na malakas nagbawas na din ako ng binubuhat kc nahihirapan lift shoulder ko dapat ba rest mna o ilaro ko lng ito advice po
  • badass_vinchbadass_vinch Posts: 4,471
    cocoy wrote:
    newbie lang po ako sa forum 6 moths na ako nagwowork out ano dapat gawin kc sa db press dati 40lbs ginagamit ko parang magaan na sakin nun nag dagdag ako ng 10lbs parang may sumakit sa shoulder ko 3 weeks na hanngang ngayon po may sakit parin at nag iba yng lakas nya dna gaya ng dati pero nailalaro ko parin pero d gaya ng dati na malakas nagbawas na din ako ng binubuhat kc nahihirapan lift shoulder ko dapat ba rest mna o ilaro ko lng ito advice po



    something must be wrong with your form. if you are using dumbells for chest exercises and you experience shoulder pain then you are using more shoulders instead of chest while pressing. unless you are doing shoulder presses then its ok but still you're rotator cuffs will suffer if your form is bad. practice your form first on lighter weights.
  • cocoycocoy Posts: 7
    @badass thanks sa reply po!nagggym parin ako kaso reduce ako sa bigat bubuhatin sabi kc mga kasamahan k sa gym mawawala din ito basta ilaro ko lng pero matatagalan kc iba na talaga yng power nya bawas pati reps ko sa press
  • frappfrivanfrappfrivan Posts: 270
    @pareng cocoy rest mo muna yan mga ilang weeks,tapos pag sumsakit pa rin pa check up mo na yan baka tendon tear na yan
  • cocoycocoy Posts: 7
    thanks sa advice frapp cguro nakuha ko ito sa bad form sa becnh press o sa nagdagdag ako sa bigat ng binuhat ko cguro pahinga mna nailalaro ko namn sa mga ibang prgram ko kaso nagbawas ako ng bigat pero sa db press at bb press hirap talaga ako kahit 90lbs na lng binubuhat ko salamat sa mga advice nyo mga bro.
  • xtend1220xtend1220 Posts: 121
    guys question lang po how do you do squats kapag walang squat rack? saka may marerefer po kayo squat rack or squat stand? for home use lang kahit 2nd hand yung small lang like this para hindi space consuming. nag inquire na ako ensayo at lawis medyo matagal pala gawin. i already looked sa sulit at raon kaso wala sila readily available either wait ng stocks or fabricated.
    042158180_00182771903341149601561148053245510thumbnailsqt.jpg

    binubuhat ko pa kasi palagi para lang makapag squat ako hehehe kaya hanap din ako squat rack or stand
    thanks po

    :sport::sport:
  • mga sir alin ba dito mas maganda?
    which do you think is best to build muscle and strength?

    Power 8 Muscle Building Workout – 3 Day Split
    http://www.muscleandstrength.com/workout...-day-split

    Bulldozer Training 3 Day Workout Split
    http://www.muscleandstrength.com/workout...kout-split

    thanks in advance! :sport:
  • nrg500nrg500 Posts: 1,233
    ^ The links are broken


    Have you tried a simple training routine like Wendler 531 or Starting Strength ?
  • monching11monching11 Posts: 7,273
    +1 sa SS
  • nrg500nrg500 Posts: 1,233
    simple training program muna involving Squats, Deadlifts (sumo or conventional) and Presses (bench and standing overhead)

    wag muna mag-alala sa abs definition or pabukulin ang biceps/triceps
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